It's taken out writer-director Dee Rees more than five years to get Pariah, her feature-length debut, in front of audiences. However, from award-winning screenings at Sundance and other festivals to critical raves, the movie—a gorgeously photographed and telling coming-of-age story of a closeted African-American teenage lesbian living in the Bronx (based on Rees's own experience)—the rewards have been worth the years of effort. Rees (whose partner, Nikisa Cooper, produced the movie) and star Adepero Oduye, who plays the 17-year-old Alike, chatted with Windy City Times about the journey. Pariah is in theatres Friday, Jan. 6.
Windy City Times: I think right at the top we have to talk about the paucity of not only out African-American filmmakers, but female filmmakers as well. That may be one reason why seeing Alike's world seems, at times, like a passage into a secret country. It's not a world we often see in movies.
Dee Rees: I wanted to tell a story about identity in Pariah that transcends race and that transcends sexuality. It's about a woman who's trying to be, and we were really trying to capture the nuance of sexuality. Alike loves women and is really clear on, but her struggle is just trying to learn how to be; she's got this über-butch friend who's pushing her to be hard and that's really not her, and her mother's pushing her to be ultra-feminine and that's not her style, either. She falls somewhere in between and so there's a range of gender identity, and it's okay not to have to check a box—and I wanted to have that layer to this film.
It's a very specific world, but within that world we get a cross-section of people and their experiences. Everybody's different and speaks differently, and I think it's important to point out that as much as these women help to transform Alike, she transforms them, too.
WCT: I'm a middle-aged gay white male and it might seem surprising that I would be so moved by the experience of this teenaged Black girl, but that speaks to the universality of the movie. Is this the reaction you've been getting from audiences?
Adepero Oduye: That's been the cool, rewarding, overwhelming part of this whole thing—that we've screened it for many, many different audiences and it's safe to say that most of the audiences have been mostly white and perhaps straight—not sure—but that people have gotten something very specific from the story. It does have a universal appeal. I think Alike's story shows how we are more similar than different.
WCT: Dee, you've mentioned that all the characters are pariahs—does that also refer, in a larger sense, to the African-American experience in the predominantly white culture?
Dee Rees: It's not meant to be a generalization of the African-American experience necessarily, but within the specific world of these specific characters. They all feel isolated at times. Everybody's just trying to find their place.
WCT: I love that you wrote this script while working on a movie with Spike Lee—during down times on the set. [Laughs] Talk about a good use of your time!
Dee Rees: Yeah, that was my first time on set. (Rees was the script supervisor on Lee's Inside Man.) I was inspired by him to have that kind of experience on my own set. He really took me under his wing and answered my questions and gave me advice. And I have to tell you—on his set I met more Black queer people than I've ever seen on a movie, and I'm very thankful for that experience and opportunity.
WCT: I think Spike Lee has gotten a bad rap sometimes in that area—particularly back when he made She Hate Me—so I'm glad to hear you address that.
Dee Rees: He has a lot of people who are Black and queer on his sets. I was just coming out at the time so it was great for me to see other Black queer faces every day working in the film business. It was an inspiration to me.
WCT: Let's talk about the actual nuts and bolts of filming. Did the money just magically appear when Spike Lee signed on as executive producer?
Dee Rees: Spike Lee came on in 2009 right before we shot, and Nikisa Cooper actually did the heavy lifting—raising the money and negotiating the crazy deals that you have to negotiate. Although we had the Sundance pedigree and the front-page raves, a lot of people just saw this as a Black lesbian film and put it in a box, so we had to really fight to get out of that box. Ultimately, the people Nikisa found to invest believed in the story first; They believed in the social bottom line.
Our first investors were a Black lesbian couple we met at OUTfest who had never invested in a film before but believed so strongly in the story. That's why this press tour has been so affirming—to find that the movie is not just this small, gay, Black film as it was being tagged, but that it really is universal in scope and is relatable to all audiences. Having Spike was a really reassuring, affirming thing; he gave us feedback on everything—the budget, the script, the editing—you name it. It was great to have such a master as a mentor. He picked up the phone when a lot of people wouldn't.
WCT: Did the success of Precious break down a few doors?
Dee Rees: I think it made people aware that there was room for a range of stories and, although our film is not like that, I think it made people feel differently about film. Audiences are savvy and are ready for all different kinds of stories.
WCT: Some of the scenes with Kim Wayans as your mother are pretty emotionally intense. As an actor, are those the kinds of scenes you look forward to getting to—"the meat" of the story?
Adepero Oduye: As an actor, it's wonderful if you just really let go and throw yourself in. At the same time, it's challenging because you have to go to places that are not comfortable and, depending upon the week, I might have had a long day of "going there" and being really open and vulnerable and there were certain times I wondered if I had any more to give—if I could continue to go deeper. But that's where a great director like Dee comes in. She created a safe place in order for that to happen. Those scenes were intense and rather thick.
WCT: Dee—those scenes must have resonated, having gone through them in your own life.
Dee Rees: When I first came out my parents weren't accepting and I went through some tough times with them but in watching those scenes I was just loving the performances and loving the hurt that Kim was showing—she wants to reach out to her daughter, but can't emotionally do that yet. As a director, I was really moved and proud and happy that the actors "went there," and I was excited by the work.
WCT: Adepero, aside from your work as an actor in the film, watching all the work that Dee and Nikisa did to make this movie happen must have been very inspiring to you.
Adepero Oduye: They're the reason that I do know for sure that anything is possible. They had this vision for Pariah and it's not been an easy road and they stuck with it—they believed in the beauty of their dream for this project and they never compromised. In spite of everything they kept moving and to be a part of that journey from beginning to end has been inspiring to say the least. I wish there was a bigger word than "inspiring." I owe a lot to Dee.
WCT: Conversely, Dee, you trusted a lot to this young actor with "your baby," so how do you feel about the result?
Dee Rees: I mean Adepero had it and I couldn't be happier with the result. It's even better than I thought it could be. The movie makes people fall in love with her and it's been beautiful to see her bring this character to life.
WCT: Is there something you'd like to say to your queer audience here in Chicago?
Dee Rees: I'd really like to thank them for staying with us and we hope that this film will be an affirmation for somebody and when they see it they'll know its okay to be themselves.
Adepero Oduye: Absolutely.
