THE VOICE OF CHICAGO'S GAY, LESBIAN, BI, TRANS AND QUEER COMMUNITY SINCE 1985

Now 27 years old, Buck has been living at home with mom, playing his favorite kiddie records over and over, endlessly sucking blo-pops, and fiddling with toys. But when mommy finally shuffles off her mortal coil, Buck zips off to LA, where he begins stalking the now grown-up Chuck in hopes of playing their old kiddie games again. Games? Well, like "Chuck and Buck Suck and Fuck." Unfortunately, Chuck —Charlie Sitter to all others—is soon to be married to Carlyn ( Beth Colt ) , and less than pleased by his ol' playmate's advances. So in a desperate bid to win the increasingly less friendly Chuck's affections once more, Buck mounts an amateur play, Hank and Frank, with the help of a snippy theater manager ( Lupe Ontiveros ) and an utterly untalented, idiot savant actor, Sam ( Paul Weitz ) who bears slight resemblance to Chuck.

Sound different? Chuck and Buck is. And not only in its story, but also its execution. Director Miguel Arteta, who garnered significant attention with his debut feature Star Maps at Sundance a few years ago, shot the film on digital video, and cast several fellow filmmakers in the lead roles. Chuck and Buck scribe White, a writer for Dawson's Creek and Freaks and Geeks, played his own dysfunctional creation, Buck. [ Did that have something to do with his real-life family—he is the son of Rev. Mel White, who was a scriptwriter for Jerry Falwell beocming coming out? ] And the Weitz brothers, Chris and Paul, writers of Antz and directors of American Pie, played Charlie and Sam respectively.

We recently sat down with the creative quartet to discuss Chuck, Buck, sucking, fucking, and the ins and outs of childhood. So to speak.

Outlines: How did you get involved on the acting side of your script, Mike?

Mike White: I had a thought when I wrote it that it would be fun to act in it, because I acted in college but never pursued it afterwards. I was pursuing writing. And with those small types of movies, usually you have to get some kind of name or something, so I never really thought it would happen, but Miguel got it funded in a way that he could do it with me.

Outlines: And you, Chris?

Chris Weitz: Miguel left a message on my machine saying 'would you like to be in this movie I'm making?' and I thought he meant a 10-minute short film. So I called back and said 'as long as it doesn't involve anal sex onscreen I'll do it.

Paul Weitz: It wasn't really nerve-wracking because it was just so out of leftfield. Miguel thought of Chris first, and then Sam was supposed to be an idiot doppelganger of Chris' character—so he came to me!

Outlines: Is it unflattering playing the idiot doppelganger of your own brother?

PW: No, it's totally fun! I'm used to the role. I think Chris' job was a lot harder because he had to tread a lot more closely on his actual personality, whereas I was just trying to make this totally repulsive guy, to have him be as nice as possible ... . But ultimately, there was a day or two where Chris and I sort of talked it over and thought 'when are we going to get the opportunity to do this again?' so we went for it.

Outlines: Miguel, how did you go from a Hispanic hustler boy movie to one about a guy who becomes sexually fixated on and stalks his childhood best friend?

Miguel Arteta: Well, I like movies about characters that don't have the tools to deal with life, to be functional, connect with people. I like the idea that Buck's real problem is he doesn't know how to connect with people. It has nothing to do with sexuality. And they're all damaged goods, each one of the characters. To me it seemed a natural progression.

Outlines: Why do you like working with damaged goods?

MA: Because I'm one, I guess.

Outlines: What's your damage?

MA: All sorts.

Outlines: Have you ever hustled?

MA: Gosh, that's an interesting question! Will it really better the understanding of the movie if I did? No, I've never done it for direct cash. I had a sugar mommy, actually.

Outlines: Does everything you've done have some sort of autobiographical angle?

MA: Well, it's stuff that interests me. The angle of Chuck and Buck which caught me was the obsession angle. Here's someone who's totally obsessed, and instead of killing himself or killing everybody else in the movie, he finds a way to work it out.

Outlines: Mike, you wrote it. How autobiographical is Chuck & Buck?

MW: It's not autobiographical. I'd say it's definitely dealing with personal themes, I feel very personal about it, but it's not autobiographical in whatever happened to me.

Outlines: Are you more Chuck or Buck?

MW: I don't know, actually. I'm probably just as much Chuck as Buck. I do think it's an alter-ego thing going on. One of the motivations for writing it was that sort of feeling—I'm always putting this face forward to everybody, but there's this other more damaged, disturbed person you try not to project.

Outlines: Have you reconciled your childhood and its attractions?

MW: I think everybody has those first, you know, crushes or whatever. Your first kiss. They linger longer than anything else. I think everybody has some kind of experience like that where you see someone from your childhood and the ghost of who they were and who they are now and how that affects your whole sense of identity, I guess ... .

Outlines: But have you ever been obsessed over anyone to the degree that Buck is of Chuck?

MW: Um. I guess ... well ... Yeah. Definitely. ( everyone laughs )

Outlines: Are they aware of it?

MW: Oh yeah.

Outlines: Do you think they might give in?

MW: If your will is strong enough, everyone gives in over time.

Outlines: Do you feel that people come up with one romantic ideal that they stay with for the rest of their life, or does it change?

MA: It changes.

CW: I think it definitely changes. Your first ideal when you're a little boy is probably your mother in one form or another, and then it changes to a little girl or a little boy, and then hopefully you learn enough to change it enough to become attracted to adults. That's probably who you're going to spend the rest of your life with if you're lucky. In this instance it kind of didn't change at a certain point.

MW: I think why Buck is an interesting character is that in a way, while he's definitely arrested development, there's something very pure about how his ideal isn't changing, and that he hasn't substituted it with a million different people that most people at that point in their life have already done. In a way it changes, but it's incremental I guess. Most people have strains of the same kind of person showing up in their life. Whether it's the way he recasts the role of Chuck with Sam, and he doesn't really fit into exactly that role. It seems the history of a lot of people's love lives is constantly recasting and projecting onto somebody what they hope that person will be of that person before. But that early person isn't even that person anymore anyway, so it's pretty tragic, the lives that we live.

Outlines: Did you experiment sexually when you were a kid, Chris?

CW: I wish I had, no. I feel really lame when people tell me about their childhood sexual experiences. I remember that when I used to visit my grandparents there was a little girl my age and we used to tie each other up but that was as far as we went. It was a kind of victim/rescue scenario—fully clothed, so it was mostly about the drama thing. That's the only childhood sexual experimentation I can remember. I really do wish I had more. Then I could have gotten off to the non-experimental stages earlier in life.

Outlines: What about you, Mike? Reserved childhood or childhood slut?

MW: Reserved childhood or childhood slut??? Uh ... I would never admit to being a childhood slut. I don't know. I think, you know, you realize you think you're weird, but as you get older you hear other people's stories and then you realize you were reserved, it was a reserved childhood.

Outlines: Is there anything you can cite or consider weird or extraordinary in your own childhood?

MW: Ummm ... I can't really think of anything.

Outlines: Chris, why does Chuck keep caving in to Buck?

CW: Well, it's easy for him to cave in because he needs to. He needs to address that part of his life.

Outlines: Is Buck actually gay, or is he just caught up in the childhood experimentation which he liked?

MW: Good question. I don't know. He's not gay in the sense ... well at least in the movie you don't get a sense that he's really attracted to men, generally. He's just fixated on Chuck, and then Sam because he's a lookalike. It's ambiguous as to where he's going to go from getting over Chuck.

MA: The movie works regardless of what interpretation you give it. One scenario I had go through my mind is that Buck is gay. He's not gay in terms of being part of a community or connected to anybody, but he's comfortable that he's attracted to another guy. That's not an issue for him. I like that that's not the character's obstacle, dealing with that.

Outlines: ( This is a spoiler question, so skip down a bit if you want to keep any surprises intact ) Charlie eventually agrees to a deal with Buck, that if he goes home with him for a night, that Buck will leave him alone forever. But that night, they actually start kissing, and to me it suggests there's more going on there than just taking part in a deal. You can go through the motions of sex, but kissing is an intimate, involving act. Is this something you mulled over, Miguel?

MA: It was definitely the intention from the start. It was in the script ...

MW: It wasn't in the script. The kiss was never in the script.

MA: Really?

MW: Shut up. You know that's true. You said ( imitating Miguel's accent ) 'I think they shood kees.'

MA: Then I'll take credit for it. Yeah, definitely, I thought of the kiss and really it's one of the best moments in the film.

CW: ( imitating Miguel ) 'OK, now, sweet keeses. Sweet leettle keeses.'

Outlines: The game—Chuck and Buck Suck and Fuck. I can see the home version already. Where did that come from?

MW: I guess I chose their names just for that moment.

Outlines: And did you consider having more onscreen sex between Chuck and Buck? Did you want to do an extended scene with butt pounding?

PW: That will be on the DVD.

MA: I thought that the love scene was actually the most magical moment for me. We discussed and talked about it, we went and did it and I was really, really moved. It was one of those moments where the crew just got moved, silent. That felt like a real, honest tender moment, and I just went outside and exhaled and was like 'we got it.'

Outlines: Was this an easy bunch of characters to come up with, Mike?

MW: Were they easy to come up with? Yeah, in the sense that I think living in LA for a while, there's a whole other side of LA you don't see depicted very much. A lot of dreamers who are lost. Whose feet aren't on the ground, who are attracted to whatever mythology LA gives off. So I wanted to do something that kind of sported some of that. Like Paul's character and Buck's character. In a way I was more interested just to show that side of LA.

Outlines: What if a Buck came stalking you?

MW: If Buck came stalking me ... I'd flee. I have no tolerance for Buck! I don't understand why people have tolerance for that side of ME! When the tables are turned ... I'd change my number, which I've done quite a few times. I'll change it again. Now that this movie's coming out.

Outlines: What about you, Chris? What if Buck came a-stalking along?

CW: I'm kind of a freak magnet, actually. If there's a strange person walking on the other side of the street, they'll gravitate towards me. Or in a crowded room, the one freak will approach me.

PW: It's because you're so polite.

CW: I tend to be perhaps a little too tolerant. If Buck were stalking me, I would probably put up with a hell of a lot. And then call the police. I don't think I'd get it on with him though, necessarily.

Outlines: Is there anyone from your past you're horribly afraid of catching up to you.

CW: No, they've all caught up to me actually. So far ...

Outlines: Final question. What is the lesson of Chuck & Buck?

MA: They should learn to tell their friends that this is a movie that they should definitely go see.

Outlines: Yeah yeah yeah. In one word, Miguel.

MA: Forgiving.

CW: Don't hire amateur actors.

MW: On that note, be careful what you wish for. It may sound like a good idea to star in a movie that plays Sundance, but you will suffer the consequences.

PW: Shit. I was gonna say it's OK to fuck and suck, but ( laughs ) it's OK to fuck and suck as long as you're kind.

The film opens July 21 in Chicago. See www.chucknbuck.com